Digital Twins for the Win! Exploring and Creating with Kyle Shannon

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0:00 hey everybody good afternoon good
0:02 morning good evening whatever time of
0:04 day it is wherever you are welcome I'm
0:06 so glad you're here we have a special
0:09 show today and I'm really excited to
0:11 introduce you to my friend Kyle Shannon
0:14 in just a minute um for those of you who
0:16 haven't been here before this is the AI
0:18 empowered fundraiser show I'm an Murphy
0:21 we um are just continuing in our series
0:25 of we don't know what we are doing here
0:29 in a I in making a live cast in showing
0:35 up on camera and talking about things
0:37 that we are barely you know sort of
0:41 beginning to wrap our arms around and
0:44 that is like what the vibe of our
0:47 extended Community is that it's totally
0:51 okay and you are most welcome to show up
0:55 as the hot messy human that you are
0:59 being in The Beginner's mindset doing
1:02 things with AI that you aren't supposed
1:06 to know how to do no one woke up one day
1:09 and was like oh I know how to write a
1:13 prompt or I know how to test the user
1:17 interfaces of five different Frontier
1:19 models or remember like the I don't know
1:23 8,000 or something new AI platforms that
1:27 are out there all of us in this space no
1:29 matter how much what you know we are all
1:32 on a journey as a beginner compared to
1:35 others what my friend Kyle who's coming
1:39 on in a second what he taught me is that
1:43 when you can be the fifth grader to the
1:46 fourth graders in this space that's when
1:49 you are ready to go that's when you are
1:51 ready for prime time that's when you can
1:53 start teaching other people how to use
1:55 the tools and he was way more than a
1:58 fifth grader to the fourth graders when
2:00 I started learning from him I'm excited
2:03 to introduce you to him and invite you
2:05 and encourage you to spend time with him
2:08 he shows up on Tik Tok almost every
2:12 single night for the past I'm gonna
2:14 guess it's like maybe 380 390 days or
2:19 something at this point it's a lot of
2:21 days and he's there every single almost
2:24 every single night teaching all of us
2:27 how to use the tools and also making it
2:31 super fun and we've all become friends
2:34 and we've all joined this community
2:36 called the AI Salon where you will meet
2:39 other beginners other people who are
2:42 aspiring you know moving in the
2:44 direction of moving away from being a
2:47 beginner but none of us show up thinking
2:50 or like fronting that we are experts in
2:53 this space and
2:55 so I'm um like I said really happy we're
2:58 going to I just dropped the the
3:03 URL who disses everyone I just dropped
3:06 the URL into the chat so that's how
3:09 you'll find Kyle's Kyle and his friend
3:12 Leah fast's Community called the AI
3:15 salon and you'll find a whole bunch of
3:18 really really nice people there um
3:21 before I bring Kyle on I wanted to
3:24 highlight a little bit of what we're
3:26 doing in the AI empowered fundraiser
3:28 World um one of the things that Kyle and
3:31 I talk about a lot is how important
3:34 Community is and I always like to say
3:37 that the three things that you need to
3:39 be you know quote unquote good at AI are
3:43 a curious mind a willingness to be
3:46 vulnerable and community and what I
3:49 found over time is that even better than
3:51 Community is friendships and
3:54 so along my AI journey I met a lot of
3:58 women who were really Ed in building
4:01 relationships around Ai and sometimes
4:04 it's just like AI is this foil character
4:06 and what we're really doing is repotting
4:09 ourselves right trying new things
4:12 together like becoming more of who we
4:17 always thought we would be looking for
4:19 opportunities to step into leadership
4:21 roles like being a leader in the AI
4:23 space is an incredibly profound role
4:26 that you can play in society right now
4:27 and this group our incubator membership
4:29 community Community is a bunch of women
4:32 who are leading the way in AI we are all
4:34 friends we connect um on Mighty networks
4:37 all day all night we have special events
4:41 we're talking about a book club we're
4:42 talking about a podcast we would love to
4:45 have you in there or at least check it
4:47 out so there's a QR code in the corner
4:50 there if you point your camera at it and
4:52 take a picture or um put your camera at
4:55 it and press the little button that pops
4:56 up you'll be able to explore the
4:59 incubator and we would love to um chat
5:02 with you who if you have any questions
5:04 so I wanted to let you know that that
5:06 exists and now I am going to bring on no
5:10 one other
5:11 than well first let me do this stop
5:13 screen
5:14 sharing I bring you my friend and soon
5:19 to be yours Kyle Shannon hey and
5:25 Murphy so everybody who if you don't
5:28 know Kyle this is Kyle and like prepare
5:32 now that you know Kyle you he you'll see
5:35 him everywhere he's it's one of those
5:37 things now that you know him you're
5:38 gonna see him everywhere and that is a
5:40 really good thing for your life so while
5:41 we have him on here I'm gonna embarrass
5:42 him a little bit so Kyle I I well I love
5:47 first of all I loved your your intro and
5:49 I I I enter as the enthusiastically
5:52 clueless so yes there we go yes we are
5:55 we are the enthusiastically clueless and
5:58 I think uh one of the things that um
6:01 really drew me to Kyle and learning from
6:04 him early on was just that sense of
6:08 nobody's trying to say here in this
6:11 community nobody's trying to trying to
6:13 act like we know what the hell is going
6:16 on and we've got all the answers and
6:18 we're literally learning together I have
6:20 watched Kyle figure stuff out in the
6:24 moment hours and hours and hours of my
6:26 life and I've learned so much in that
6:28 process so first I want to say thank you
6:31 for being willing to show up like half
6:35 baked right you're not you're not saying
6:37 like I'm I'm ready I'm I'm the leader of
6:41 the leaders I know all the things and
6:43 you have the chops you have the
6:44 experience you could be like that but
6:46 you're not and that allows all of us to
6:49 show up and learn as well I could you
6:51 know note to self I'll try to be
6:52 douchier in the future but um no it's
6:55 just like I
6:57 feel like
7:00 I
7:02 feel in a lot of ways less capable than
7:05 I ever have because the tools the tools
7:07 are evolving and getting so capable that
7:10 that you know my ability to understand
7:13 what to do with them is actually going
7:14 down but um but yeah I I I think it's
7:17 just um I think it's more fun to be in a
7:19 beginner's mindset but I actually think
7:21 it's actually critical for where we are
7:22 with AI right now so thank you I'm I'm
7:25 really exced to be here okay say more
7:28 about The Beginner's mindset
7:30 what does that mean to
7:32 you
7:39 well be willing to be in that
7:42 uncomfortable place where that internal
7:44 voice in your head is going you're just
7:46 big fat dum
7:49 dum like let yourself just be the Dum
7:51 Dum like it I don't know for me
7:54 personally the way I sort of operate is
7:56 I love figuring stuff out and and I kind
7:58 of hate being in that place where can't
8:00 figure it out and I happen to have a
8:01 brain that's good at figuring out things
8:04 fast this AI stuff is a completely
8:07 different way of using a computer like
8:09 you know with with traditional Computing
8:12 it's programmed it's it's deterministic
8:14 where you put in an input and you get
8:16 back a predictable output AI is not that
8:19 AI is you kind of say your words right
8:23 you I think of like training a toddler
8:25 okay say your words you want cake say
8:28 you want cake and
8:31 that's kind of like where we are with AI
8:34 and and you say I want cake and then it
8:36 gives you back something that may or may
8:37 not be what you want and and people
8:42 that go into that place of wanting to
8:46 figure it out and wanting to to have it
8:47 be
8:48 predictable I find I I watch them I
8:51 witness them being increasingly
8:53 frustrated because it it doesn't quite
8:56 give them what they want and then those
8:58 people that are just like well let me
8:59 see what I get and I'll come in here and
9:01 I'll just ask it for what I want and it
9:02 gives me that and then they go well
9:04 that's not what I wanted but that's kind
9:05 of cool and then they're willing to
9:06 expand on that or iterate on that they
9:09 tend to be much more
9:11 um you know happy for one thing like
9:14 less frustrated but they also tend to do
9:16 really remarkable work because the the
9:20 the difference between say what we used
9:22 to do with Google which was put in a
9:24 single prompt and get back you know your
9:26 search results um AI is much more like a
9:29 conversation
9:30 and and it it really is like having a
9:32 conversation with you know the most
9:35 educated clueless intern you've ever
9:38 hired right where it knows lots of stuff
9:41 but it doesn't know anything about you
9:43 or what you're trying to accomplish and
9:45 and the minute you sort of flipped your
9:47 mindset into oh it's like it's like
9:49 someone I have to get up to speed on
9:51 things but once I do that it gives me
9:53 remarkable results that's that's kind of
9:56 it so for me that's a beginner's mindset
9:58 where where you know our ability to to
10:02 be masters of these tools I I don't
10:06 think is ever going to really exist I
10:08 think it's going to be an ongoing
10:10 conversation uh with with tools that are
10:12 just increasingly capable and that that
10:15 intern at some point is going to be more
10:17 like a you know first year graduate and
10:20 then it's going to be like a you know uh
10:23 you know a you know someone with a
10:25 10-year employment history and then at
10:27 some point they're just going to be way
10:29 better than us on all levels and
10:31 everything and we just got to Humble it
10:33 up we got to Humble it up
10:36 I when when you play charades right and
10:41 you're the person who's acting the thing
10:42 out and nobody can guess what you're
10:45 acting out it's like well who's the
10:47 dummy is it the person who's it's the
10:50 person who's acting it out and doing a
10:51 horrible job like you know you're like
10:53 this and they're like oh and you're like
10:55 it's a sailboat obviously they're like I
10:57 thought it was an orange or a blueberry
10:59 it's not their fault it's not your fault
11:02 right but it's that's like talking to
11:04 Chad GPT where you learn for yourself
11:06 like oh if I go like this they're gonna
11:09 know that it's a sailboat not a
11:11 blueberry if I go like that we're
11:14 totally gonna run a ground yeah it's a
11:16 bit of a dance right it's a bit of a
11:18 dance and and and like and that's not I
11:22 mean I mean you and I are of an age like
11:24 we we've been around really since the
11:26 the dawn of personal computers they've
11:28 always behaved a certain way and with
11:30 this AI stuff they don't behave that way
11:32 so like like we're not used to dancing
11:35 with them and you know the the new
11:36 advanced voice from chat
11:38 GPT it can understand your emotions as
11:42 well as your words and it can respond in
11:44 kind and it and it's we're not used
11:47 to computers actually acting like the
11:50 stuff that was always in science fiction
11:52 movies when we grew up and it's this is
11:55 something that we're going to have to
11:56 learn how to how to interact with and
11:58 it's it's not learn learn it like we
12:00 used to learn it no it's not learn it
12:03 like we used to learn it so today we
12:06 were working I have a our one of our AI
12:09 boot camps is going on right now my
12:11 friend Rachel Kimber and I are running
12:12 it and today we were working on a
12:15 fundraising initiative and our our
12:17 project was to come up with some
12:19 messaging but kind of working against a
12:23 couple of different personas so like the
12:25 old you know retired engineering guy the
12:29 you know Jen Z you know startup whatever
12:33 and testing our messaging against them
12:35 and when I walked when I you know set up
12:38 this exercise my goal was really very
12:41 you know output oriented let's be sure
12:43 that we have messaging that's going to
12:45 work and what I realized halfway through
12:47 it was that's not actually the exercise
12:50 the exercise is having it not work well
12:53 having watching Everybody try one thing
12:56 and then try another thing you know yep
12:59 much more important to to kind of like
13:02 roll up your sleeves well play first
13:04 like we talk about in the AI Salon
13:06 everyone wants to we're thinking about
13:08 efficiency right we think we I think AI
13:12 gets kind of like a little bit oversold
13:14 on the efficiency front than some of the
13:18 quality and the creativity and stuff but
13:20 let's say we're using it to be super
13:22 efficient and we're thinking about we're
13:24 here we want this outcome we haven't
13:26 made time and space to play so what we
13:29 were all you know talking about was how
13:32 do you find time in your life just to
13:35 play with AI and I shared with all of
13:39 them like all of your peeps in the AI
13:42 Salon we just don't sleep as much as we
13:44 used
13:46 to that's a possibility there there's
13:49 there's another piece of it though one
13:50 of the i i i my relationship to AI as an
13:56 efficiency tool transformed probably
13:58 about a year ago because the first thing
14:00 I did when I started playing with AI I
14:02 was like oh I can make the stuff I do it
14:04 work more efficient and at some point it
14:07 hit me that thinking of AI just as
14:10 making the stuff that you do today more
14:12 efficient is actually dramatically
14:15 limiting because all you're thinking
14:17 about is here's what I do today and I
14:20 want to make that more efficient that's
14:22 how we've historically thought of
14:23 computers right it's this machine that's
14:25 going to do something for me so here's
14:27 what I do today I want to make that more
14:30 what struck me was part of the part of
14:33 how we got to play first is that if you
14:36 say okay well this is what I do today
14:38 but we now have the possibility of
14:40 saying what if that weren't the best way
14:42 to do things what if we could do things
14:44 completely different so rather than
14:45 making this thing more efficient what if
14:48 there's something completely different
14:49 we could do the only way you can really
14:51 get to that is to essentially drop your
14:54 expectations entirely right just put
14:57 your expectations to the side and say
14:59 okay I'm going to go do something
15:01 ridiculous here so let's say you you
15:03 want to work on um I I'll do something
15:06 really extreme let's say you've got a uh
15:09 I don't know an email process that that
15:11 you want to make more efficient you know
15:12 how you would typically do that is you'd
15:14 figure out the process You' go to zappy
15:16 or You' figure out which parts go to
15:17 open AI well what if you took that same
15:20 time you were going to do that and you
15:21 went to sunno and you said I want to
15:23 write a song about how to do
15:26 emails that doesn't make any sense at
15:28 all it makes right and then what'll
15:30 happen is it'll write a song about
15:33 emails that will go give you an idea of
15:35 like wait a minute maybe I should
15:36 actually send songs to my clients
15:38 instead of these shitty update emails
15:40 and that's Jim Ross who I think is
15:42 watching on the stream um he he manages
15:45 self storage units and he's super he is
15:48 I would I would call him AI native like
15:50 he he tries to think first about using
15:53 AI to solve his problems and he's just
15:55 really adventurous he does something for
15:56 his business with AI an hour a day every
15:59 morning morning which I think is amazing
16:01 and and one night on the Tik Tok lives I
16:03 was I was saying here's how you make a
16:05 song and Jim was just like well I've got
16:07 a client I just met with a couple hours
16:09 ago why don't I just make them a song
16:11 about their business and he did and he
16:13 closed the business within five minutes
16:15 right that's not something that makes
16:19 sense right it doesn't make any sense um
16:23 and and yet if you do that it it will
16:26 open up all sorts of other avenues and
16:28 you will learn the tools
16:30 in a way that you're going to be able to
16:31 go back to that you know that efficiency
16:34 project that you had with a completely
16:36 different mindset so so for that's again
16:39 that kind of goes back to the beginner
16:40 mindset just being don't be tied to
16:42 outcomes as much as we were historically
16:45 absolutely and and think about it as an
16:48 opportunity like have it in the back of
16:50 your mind all the time that this might
16:52 be an opportunity to break what's
16:54 already broken for example your email
16:56 newsletter that you're trying to
16:58 automate probably sucks
17:02 anyway all of them do all of ours do I
17:05 have one it kind of sucks like I mean
17:07 it's good it's the you know it's but
17:09 it's also it's still an email newsletter
17:11 and there are 85,000 of them in my inbox
17:13 right now that I haven't read yep and so
17:16 when you're when you have the attitude
17:19 the approach of like let's break what's
17:21 already broken and you get a wild hair
17:24 you or you've like been on the AI Salon
17:26 you're like they were what was the name
17:27 of that thing was it suo was it
17:30 clug was it Crea was it cling was it
17:33 whatever yeah all what was it and you
17:37 may not even you may get it wrong and
17:38 all of a sudden you're in a different AI
17:40 application yeah but then all of a
17:41 sudden you're like oh maybe I should be
17:43 sending songs to my clients rather than
17:46 another same newsletter that I've been
17:49 sending them for the last three or four
17:50 years so there's so much room for
17:53 creativity I've learned so much about
17:55 like my own in my own Journey about how
17:58 creative I actually am I never ever
18:02 thought of myself as a creative and
18:04 that's one of the things that you know
18:06 that we've talked about is like how do
18:08 you kind of step into what you're
18:11 learning about yourself that may have
18:14 always may have been there forever but
18:18 you just didn't have a way to uncover it
18:21 you know that that strikes me when I was
18:23 doing um I was the chief creative
18:26 officer and the co-founder of a an early
18:28 digital agency in the in the 90s called
18:30 agency.com
18:32 and at one point we started to have some
18:34 some cultural problems where the
18:37 creatives the you know the the ones that
18:39 were called you know creatives were like
18:42 well we're creative and everyone else is
18:43 not creative and the fact of the matter
18:45 was that the account people were
18:47 creative and how they engaged with
18:48 clients and the project managers were
18:50 creative and how they did project
18:52 management and one of the things that
18:54 that we distinguished that made a big
18:56 difference was there's a very big
18:58 difference between the creative process
19:00 and the creative product so the creative
19:03 product is like I make pictures right so
19:05 maybe you're not good at pictures an
19:07 maybe you're not good at drawing right
19:08 maybe you're not even good at design but
19:10 you're really good at the creative
19:11 process and what happens with AI now is
19:14 you now have tools that allow you to be
19:17 way more creative um
19:19 creative especially in terms of the
19:21 creative product but you've always been
19:24 creative right and so what this is doing
19:26 is kind of connecting those two worlds
19:28 and I I think that's incredible powerful
19:30 the newsletter that that you just
19:31 mentioned I I just had an epiphany today
19:34 so one thing I've been pretty good at
19:36 over the past I don't know year or so is
19:38 I'll have an idea for an article and
19:40 I'll put the article out there and I go
19:41 oh I should make an image for the
19:42 article right which historically I would
19:44 never have done that it would have been
19:45 just words so if your newsletter is just
19:48 words maybe think about putting pictures
19:50 in it and then the thing that struck me
19:51 today I I applied for the uh the
19:54 creators program for some new video tool
19:57 and I thought wait why am I just putting
20:00 pictures in my LinkedIn articles I
20:01 should have moveed I should have video
20:03 in there we've got these amazing new
20:05 video tools right so so historically you
20:08 would never have necessarily thought
20:10 about original artwork for a newsletter
20:12 well now maybe you could start to think
20:13 about original video that goes with you
20:16 know your article why if nothing else
20:18 people will look at it right people like
20:20 moving pictures so so anyway so um first
20:24 of all I have to tell you I want to move
20:26 into a little bit of the existential
20:27 which will include our conversation
20:29 about digital twins but here's here's a
20:31 jumping off point it'll it'll give I
20:33 wanted you to take a second to talk a
20:35 little bit about your backstory and what
20:37 you're up to right now and Story vine
20:40 and the salon and um kind of where
20:43 you're going with some of your content
20:45 but I'll I'll kick it off by saying that
20:47 we're so for folks who are who are here
20:50 we're also streaming to Kyle's Tik Tok
20:54 Channel which is probably like gonna
20:57 soon be like 247
20:59 um and a I was watching the comments as
21:02 as one does and a minute ago somebody
21:04 said are you retired or is this the
21:08 job so Kyle oh that's fascinating
21:12 describe your job right now what do you
21:15 what would you say your job is well my
21:18 my job at storyvine I'm the I'm the
21:21 co-founder and CEO of storyvine so I'm
21:23 running Story vine um I I tend not to do
21:27 one of the reasons I go live at T talk
21:29 at night is because that's what I do
21:31 when I go home so um so if I'm doing a a
21:33 podcast or something like this that that
21:35 invades in the day so I've got that as
21:37 my day
21:38 job a big part of so storyvine is a an
21:42 automated video storytelling platform
21:44 we've been around for 12 and a half
21:46 years um we do a lot of work in the
21:48 healthcare and Pharma space the platform
21:51 the core platform itself let's call it
21:53 storyvine 1.0 didn't actually use a lot
21:55 of AI it used more traditional computing
21:59 assembly XML and just more traditional
22:01 kind of stuff fully automated right we
22:03 have an app that somebody answers
22:05 questions in an app that goes up to the
22:06 cloud five minutes later you've got a
22:08 fully edited video so really powerful
22:11 platform
22:13 but because so so a little part of my
22:16 background I've got a storytelling
22:18 background I've got a degree in acting I
22:20 moved to New York City out of school ran
22:22 a theater company wrote a bunch of
22:23 screenplays just you know Pursuit a life
22:25 in the Arts and then in the mid 90s when
22:28 the worldwide web when I when I stumbled
22:30 upon this thing called the worldwide web
22:32 it it struck me that this is a
22:34 completely new way to tell stories and
22:36 so I started an online magazine and I
22:38 started you know agency.com this early
22:41 agency where we built a lot of the
22:43 websites for the Fortune 500 and what
22:45 struck me was this is you know sort of
22:48 telling a brand story in this
22:50 interactive environment it's still
22:52 storytelling um Story vine is that as
22:55 well right it's AI came
22:57 out what hit me square between the eyes
23:00 especially you know for me November 30th
23:03 2022 is the Turning Point the seminal
23:07 moment um of of what I'll call Modern AI
23:10 um the generative AI movement that date
23:13 is the date that chat GPT launched and
23:16 chat
23:17 GPT from where I sit does for AI what
23:21 the worldwide web did for the internet
23:23 so let me unpack that a
23:25 bit the internet had been around for
23:27 decades and decades right all these
23:29 computers connected together and the the
23:31 only people that could really use them
23:33 were scientists and researchers and
23:34 things like that because it was a
23:35 commandline computer interface and you
23:38 had to know know IP addresses and it was
23:40 just it was very technical and the
23:42 worldwide web made it just simple as
23:44 like clicking a hyperlink to be able to
23:46 jump between these computers and that's
23:48 the foundation for all of you know sort
23:50 of modern Communications was that simple
23:52 Innovation chat GPT was the first thing
23:55 that took all this power of machine
23:56 learning and Ai and put it in this
23:58 simple box that where you just ask it
24:00 for something and it it answers it or
24:02 you know gives you the picture or
24:04 whatever it is um so that became the
24:06 beginning of it and and for
24:09 me having been at the beginning of the
24:11 worldwide web and looking at the
24:13 potential of AI this era that we're in
24:17 feels a thousand times 10,000 times a
24:21 100,000 times more impactful longterm
24:24 than the worldwide web was and we know
24:26 how transformative that was so the
24:29 minute I had that Epiphany about AI like
24:32 being at the beginning of this new era
24:35 um I just went all in so I I essentially
24:37 spend all of my free time just looking
24:40 at Twitter looking at these things just
24:41 paying attention to it and one of the
24:44 reasons that I started the salon and one
24:46 of the reasons I started the Tik Tok
24:48 channel was just to keep myself in the
24:51 conversation on a daily basis like that
24:53 to me is everything because it's moving
24:57 so fast that that if not in the
24:59 conversation it's literally accelerating
25:01 out away from us even if you're in the
25:03 conversation right um and so so you know
25:07 my typical day just kind of looks like I
25:09 wake up I start looking at stuff on the
25:12 internet uh I'll make a Tik Tock video
25:14 occasionally um I come and do my work
25:17 and then you know if news pops up during
25:19 the day I'll go look at that and pay
25:21 attention to it and then I talk about
25:23 that at night and the you know one of
25:26 the big surprises of the Tik Tok channel
25:30 is that the way I had it in my head was
25:32 you start a Tik Tok channel it's a it's
25:34 a media channel and you make content and
25:36 you have an audience that watches that
25:38 content and what it very very quickly
25:41 became was this collaborative jam
25:44 session where people come and hang out
25:46 and like there's more activity going on
25:48 in the comments between people than
25:50 there is between me and the audience
25:52 right it's it's this really just fluid
25:55 amazing just jam session and and for me
25:58 that's that's tremendously exciting
26:00 because what it means is people are in
26:01 there exploring this AI stuff
26:03 independent of what I'm doing and that's
26:05 that's the whole idea it's so true like
26:09 we are sometimes you're like the foil
26:12 character up there and we're riffing off
26:15 of sometimes what you're talking about
26:17 sometimes we're making fun of you yeah
26:18 exactly so appropriately appropriately
26:22 making fun it's so easy
26:25 Kyle that's why I'm there but like last
26:29 night so I'm going to Paris tomorrow and
26:32 last night I was like oh my gosh I know
26:35 that I've heard which applications are
26:38 the best to use for translating in real
26:41 time I was like of course I can ask tgbt
26:44 of course I can figure this out but you
26:46 know what it'll take me eight seconds to
26:48 just ask somebody in your comments and
26:50 within you know about 10 seconds P had
26:53 had written back and said use this this
26:55 is how you do it I'm like okay boom it's
26:57 such a wealth of information and so one
27:00 of the things that um Kyle and I have
27:03 both learned and seen in action and
27:07 watched other people like grow and
27:09 Blossom is that when you create a
27:12 container for this kind of relationship
27:15 building it gives people something to
27:17 hold on to it gives them a little
27:19 foothold a reason to talk about AI or a
27:22 forum for talking about AI today after
27:25 you've worn out your spouses your kids
27:28 your parents your
27:30 dogs we don't want to hear about your
27:32 stupid
27:36 AI I can't handle it anymore then you
27:41 have your new friends your AI friends to
27:43 talk your weirdos yeah exactly well and
27:46 and so the here's the other thing that
27:49 there's a couple of reasons why
27:50 Community I think become way more
27:52 important one is it you you have a place
27:55 to connect with other people but the
27:56 other one is kind of what you did with
27:58 Pate there
28:01 AI just gener just let's just call it
28:03 generative AI even if you're just
28:05 talking about large language models the
28:07 word things right yeah that part of the
28:10 industry is already bigger than any
28:12 single person's ability to master it and
28:15 so what ends up happening when you're in
28:16 a community is you'll have some little
28:19 piece of the puzzle and what I
28:21 experience regularly is that people
28:24 consistently apologize for how little
28:27 they know and then they share this
28:30 little thing that they know that to them
28:31 is obvious because that's what they it's
28:34 who they are right they they their world
28:36 view is they understand whatever it is
28:38 like with you fundraising right and you
28:40 share this little thing about
28:42 fundraising that to the other people in
28:44 the room are like oh my God I never
28:46 would have thought about it like that
28:47 like all of the individuals people's
28:50 points of view I I find them you know I
28:54 I I work hard to get people to not
28:56 apologize for what they don't know
28:58 because it's what they do know that is
29:00 the thing that's going to break things
29:02 open for someone else so that part of
29:04 it's really really important yeah you
29:08 know I have seen a a transformation
29:12 among all of us that we have done such a
29:15 we've like really moved out of that
29:17 space of apologizing as much as we used
29:19 to yeah we had somebody in our group
29:22 today apologizing for something and we
29:24 just uh had this conversation about
29:27 impostor syndrome yeah exactly hit them
29:29 a whole bunch but you know that this is
29:33 this is a time when uh you know like
29:37 showing up and feeling uncomfortable is
29:40 is the is the work it's the work that
29:43 that's a great way to put it that that
29:44 just being in that uncomfortable SP
29:46 place and doing it anyway is the work
29:49 right that's the definition of of
29:51 Bravery right or of Courage you know
29:53 taking action in the face of fear that
29:56 yeah you don't know everything and yeah
29:58 historically you had to have a PhD in
30:00 mathematics to be good at Ai and your
30:02 fear might be well I was never good at
30:04 math what you're going to discover is
30:06 you don't need to be but you do have to
30:09 go through that Gauntlet of of knowing
30:13 that you can't do it only to discover
30:15 that not only can you do it you might be
30:17 really really good at it you might even
30:20 be really really really good at
30:21 something you thought you would never in
30:23 your life be good at and that's the
30:25 inspiring thing for me it's so inspiring
30:28 and it's so addictive that I'm now
30:30 looking for things that I don't know how
30:32 to do to do yeah
30:35 so that playful thing right just oh it's
30:38 so fun so I'm applying I'm I'm
30:40 submitting a a proposal for this gig
30:44 that it's not like Way Beyond my zone of
30:48 Genius but it's beyond my zone of Genius
30:51 right but I also know I can figure this
30:55 out like I have enough intuition enough
30:57 experience using AI tools now that I
31:00 trust myself I trust my judgment yeah
31:03 that I will be able to leverage the
31:06 tools at my disposal to do something
31:10 that I don't have a track record that's
31:12 proven that I can do the thing anymore
31:14 that's what's so exciting about all of
31:16 us you were talking about I wanted to
31:17 shift into a little bit of the
31:19 existential space that you've been
31:20 talking about like the future of work
31:22 that's what's so exciting to me is we
31:25 are now at the mode where it is
31:28 imperative that organizational leaders
31:32 understand that you are not hiring for
31:34 somebody's track record anymore or SK or
31:37 their skills their skills or their
31:40 skills or their skills and that's gonna
31:42 seem really counterintuitive if you're
31:43 if you're on the outside of this AI
31:45 conversation because we're not there yet
31:47 but like where this is trending where
31:49 this is heading is that the AI tools are
31:51 getting more and more capable and
31:53 they're going to increasingly do the
31:54 Tactical part of your job and so the
31:57 thing you went to college for the thing
31:59 that you might have been doing for the
32:00 last 10 or 15 or 30 years it's going to
32:04 do it doesn't mean you don't have value
32:06 it's just that that particular piece of
32:08 it now becomes less and less and less
32:11 required right so yes so talk a little
32:16 bit about where your head is at because
32:19 a bunch of us there's been a group of us
32:20 who I think have been going through a
32:23 similar kind of Reckoning or rethinking
32:27 of our p path forward if you will and
32:30 what's happening around us and what we
32:31 want to focus on and it's been
32:34 remarkable to me how many of us have
32:35 been in pretty very pretty similar
32:37 Milestones along the way and one of the
32:39 things that has come up and that you've
32:42 been talking about is that you know
32:44 where where your thinking is beyond the
32:48 tools that you've done a lot to help us
32:52 figure out the tools but like the the
32:55 conversation is actually bigger bigger
32:57 than that now so can you talk a little a
33:00 little bit about that yeah so again I'll
33:02 I'll I'll sort of use my experience in
33:04 the the early days of the web as as
33:06 reference because I I actually I'm
33:09 realizing now it's it's actually an
33:10 important reference point the early days
33:13 of the worldwide
33:15 web the technology of of HTTP and HTML
33:21 was actually quite simple and there was
33:25 a lot of work that was required to make
33:27 it UB and it evolved and things like
33:29 that but it didn't necessarily change
33:31 all that much
33:33 so you know for five or six years it was
33:36 really all about the tools it was like
33:38 if you learn the tools and you just you
33:39 know keep up with how things are
33:41 evolving you can do it I mean that was
33:43 one of the remarkable things about that
33:45 is it democratized this incredibly
33:47 powerful thing when generative AI first
33:50 started and there was chat GPT and then
33:53 there was stable diffusion and mid
33:54 Journey for images and I don't there
33:56 were a couple of Music things but udio
33:58 and sunno weren't really out yet and
34:00 weren't really known it was it was a
34:02 really small set of tools that you
34:04 needed to know and then as time went on
34:06 there became more and more and more and
34:08 more
34:10 and one of the things that's happened in
34:12 the past six months you know may maybe
34:15 this past month you know Let It Go but
34:17 the six months prior to that was open AI
34:20 kind of stagnated they they said they
34:22 were going to launch a bunch of stuff
34:23 and didn't and what happened was in that
34:26 time a lot of other tools caught up with
34:28 it and so so all of a sudden kind of
34:31 over the course of the summer all these
34:33 tools became remarkably capable and they
34:36 they did all sorts of different things
34:37 like Claude you can ask it to write a
34:39 computer application and it'll write it
34:41 and you can just start playing a game
34:43 that you just created by asking for it
34:45 and then perplexity does this cool
34:47 research stuff and you know open AI has
34:50 all these different modes that you can
34:51 play like all of the tools just got
34:53 really sophisticated and and there
34:56 became so many of them that it
34:58 essentially became impossible to keep up
35:02 with it right and so part of it was just
35:04 overwhelm of like even if like I you
35:06 know it was my self- declared job I
35:08 created this thing called the AI
35:10 learning lab where I'm going to teach
35:11 people how to use these
35:12 tools and what's what's struck me and
35:15 what I've I've been in a bit of mourning
35:17 for I think is the Simplicity of
35:22 that that if if it were just about the
35:25 tools that would be awesome but it's
35:27 it's not and and there's a couple of
35:28 things that have happened in the past
35:30 month or so the release of of advanced
35:34 voice from chat GPT where when you talk
35:36 with it you're you're talking with an
35:38 entity whatever it's doing technically I
35:41 don't care there's all there's always
35:42 these semantic arguments well it's not
35:44 really emotional it's not really this it
35:46 doesn't the the the impact of talking to
35:49 it is not like anything we've ever
35:51 experienced before the 01 reasoning
35:54 model that that open AI just released is
35:57 this incredibly capable thing that looks
36:01 kind of like what chat GPT looked like
36:03 before but it's essentially like having
36:05 a PhD at your fingertips that can do PhD
36:08 level problem solving at your request I
36:11 don't know how to ask for I wouldn't
36:14 know what to ask a PhD you know to say
36:17 like what am I supposed to solve here
36:19 like I just I feel like all of a sudden
36:21 the the the these tools sort of elevated
36:24 above where my cognitive boundaries were
36:29 what they can do is significantly
36:33 beyond what I understand I should use
36:35 computers for yes yes and so then that
36:39 puts me in a place of that well first of
36:42 all they're only going to get better so
36:44 if they're already above that place like
36:45 what's it going to be like when we do
36:47 hit AGI artificial general intelligence
36:50 or ASI artificial super intelligence
36:52 where these machines are smarter than
36:55 you know the smartest human on the
36:56 planet and we've all got you know a
36:59 100,000 you know genius level agents
37:02 working on our behalf what does that
37:03 world look like I don't have a clue
37:06 right and so and so now I'm just in this
37:09 place of like I think we need to start
37:12 asking questions more like why then how
37:16 it's not how do you do this it's like
37:18 wait well what am I trying to do why
37:20 would I do this like you
37:22 know I don't know like what makes me
37:24 happy like it it you go into these into
37:27 just much more highlevel existential
37:30 conversations and this is one of the
37:32 things that is has been an instinct of
37:35 mine for a while and this this feels
37:36 like it's amplifying is I feel like
37:39 these tools are going to force us as
37:42 humans to answer the question what what
37:46 value do we really serve because
37:47 historically our value was tied to the
37:50 stuff we did right the work product we
37:53 did the skills we had and now it's going
37:56 to come to you know do I make Anne happy
37:59 do I connect with her do I make a
38:00 difference in her life do I right you
38:03 know are are we connecting as humans
38:05 like I think it counterintuitively the
38:08 robot robots are going to push us to be
38:11 better people but that transition is
38:13 going to be weird and painful and
38:16 surreal and so so that's what I'm kind
38:18 of in the middle of is just this S I
38:21 don't know like this primordial soup of
38:24 I don't quite know what work looks like
38:26 and and you you know it still looks like
38:28 what it looks like
38:29 today but not for
38:32 long uh if you are a a coach a therapist
38:37 a
38:38 psychologist but you're about like they
38:41 are going to be busier than the patent
38:43 and copyright attorneys absolutely we
38:46 are all flailing about in these
38:49 communities having like existential
38:52 meltdowns not like we can't this is
38:55 unfathomably confrontational to our
38:58 identity what we think like how we're
39:00 oriented what we do when we wake up in
39:02 the morning and we're just trying to
39:04 help each other out we don't know what
39:06 we're doing we need somebody to help us
39:09 like have a framework for how to apply
39:12 this stuff because I I absolutely agree
39:14 with you that it's so much more
39:17 about
39:18 um it's not well certainly not about the
39:22 volume that you're putting out like it's
39:25 not about o I did this thing and I did a
39:27 ton of it that means I am valuable and
39:31 it's not going to be what this weirdness
39:34 that we've had in our society for
39:35 literally since slavery of my value is
39:40 measured by Time by by the hours I put
39:43 in how many hours I put in and like that
39:47 that little thing right there of and
39:50 I've I've heard people say I I've got
39:51 I've gotten an arguments over this where
39:53 they're like but that only took 10
39:55 seconds well okay does that it's less
39:58 valuable right and it's you know there's
39:59 this famous um it was Picasso I think
40:02 was it Picasso or vano I think it was
40:04 Picasso someone said make a sketch for
40:06 me and he made a sketch and he said
40:07 that'll be a million Franks and she said
40:09 well it only took you a minute he goes
40:10 it took me 40 years you know to to be
40:13 able to do that in 10 seconds um yeah
40:16 like like
40:18 t a lot of historically us putting in
40:22 the two hours to write the email was
40:25 where we measured our personal value and
40:26 where other people me measured the value
40:28 and so now if that's just done instantly
40:30 the instinct is to go oh it's valueless
40:33 but it's not no because it's still us
40:36 curating it it's still us choosing what
40:38 is the stuff we want to present to the
40:39 world like I think we're all still just
40:41 as responsible for what we put in the
40:44 world how we generate that is in my
40:47 opinion no one's business no one's
40:49 business anymore like I don't you don't
40:52 ask me if I use Microsoft Word or if I
40:54 touch that up in Photoshop like right
40:57 it's just like like is it good or not
40:59 and if it's not then just tell me the
41:01 work's not good if it's good then it's
41:03 none of your business how I made it so
41:05 that's that's part of my philosophy of
41:07 did you use AI who cares who
41:10 cares yeah definitely like decoupling
41:13 value and time is gonna be I think one
41:16 of the biggest pain points that we have
41:19 because people are so used to feeling
41:23 worthy based on putting time into
41:26 something and we're you you don't know
41:28 by the way what might be the worst thing
41:31 that happens initially is if we all do
41:34 seize the time that is newly available
41:37 if we've if we're just trying to do
41:39 something faster right and we have let's
41:42 just say you have one new hour a week
41:46 you are faced with what seems like a not
41:49 very big decision but is actually a huge
41:52 decision what are you going to do with
41:53 that one
41:55 hour soon you're going to have 40 hours
41:58 right or 35 hours so well this is I'm WR
42:02 I'm writing a musical on the weekends
42:04 like I have a degree in theater I've
42:06 never written a musical I'm not good
42:07 enough with music to write it but it
42:10 it's good like it's good it's really
42:13 good and it's just like this weekend
42:15 project right and it's like and it's I'm
42:16 not taking you know eight hours a day on
42:19 the weekend it's like I do an hour here
42:21 an hour there and and I'm cranking this
42:23 out and that that idea of so so one of
42:26 the other things when you were talking
42:27 about we're all in these existential
42:29 dreads I don't want to make it sound
42:31 like it's always existential dread
42:32 negative it's what I'm finding is that
42:34 there's these really big oscillations
42:37 these emotional oscillations of oh my
42:39 God it's amazing oh my God what do I do
42:41 with my life oh my God it's amazing I I
42:44 I I I for the past month and a half I've
42:46 been in one of the troughs right I've
42:47 just been in like what is this what's it
42:48 mean all that sort of stuff and I saw
42:51 this LinkedIn post from Ali K Miller who
42:53 talks about um you know AI stuff and the
42:57 opening line of her LinkedIn post was um
43:01 holy crap I wrote a whole uh course this
43:06 weekend or something like that and and
43:08 just her starting it with that that term
43:10 holy crap was I realized that if you
43:13 just play with AI and and play with it
43:16 in your spare time play with it at work
43:18 play with it just
43:21 mindlessly yes what you stumble upon are
43:24 these holy crap moments that actually
43:27 run you in completely different
43:28 directions like writing a musical or it
43:31 might be something at work that you know
43:32 rather than the two hours of automating
43:34 that email process I just mess around
43:36 for two hours but but I discover
43:39 something completely new and have a holy
43:40 crap moment that's going to be a
43:42 breakthrough for my business or a
43:43 breakthrough for me profession
43:45 professionally and so I wrote a I wrote
43:47 a piece called the uh Ai and the holy
43:49 crapp ification of work which is sort of
43:51 the positive you know other side of this
43:54 if you get curious with these tools and
43:56 really dive in with them um they are
44:00 increasingly going to surprise you in
44:02 positive and really powerful ways that
44:05 may be transformative for your business
44:07 you know your professional life or your
44:09 personal life or all three all three all
44:12 the same yes and I should say that that
44:14 the
44:16 existential space that a lot of us are
44:18 in is is in part be pretty joyous and
44:23 kind of like surprising right you're
44:27 like constantly surprised it's the
44:29 constant Kevin McAllister moment that we
44:31 talk about yep um okay so to give the
44:35 people what we promised can we talk
44:37 about digital twins uh teach me first
44:41 Dena is saying what word processor are
44:43 you using exactly to write musical Kyle
44:47 what what yeah exactly what brand of
44:49 notepad are you taking your notes on
44:51 right now an right that's really
44:53 important for us to know so annoying um
44:56 all right so talk to us about digital
44:58 twins can you start with like what are
45:00 we talking about hell is a digital twin
45:03 yeah yes so historically the the term
45:06 digital twin twin um really emerged out
45:09 of the simulation world and a digital
45:11 twin might be you have a digital twin of
45:13 a physical object or or you know a
45:16 system um my friend Richard Boyd has
45:19 been doing a simulation work and 3D work
45:22 for years and years and years and one of
45:24 the digital twins he made for the
45:26 defense department was a digital twin of
45:28 a nuclear submarine so it was a fully
45:31 functional nuclear submarine that people
45:33 you know Sailors could go into with you
45:35 know goggles or computer screens and
45:38 like all of the dials worked all of the
45:40 things did the things and they could
45:42 basically go in and run a submarine
45:44 virtually right so the so the the
45:46 history of it is
45:48 that the the the digital twins that I've
45:51 been working on we kind of stumbled upon
45:54 so I'm the chief generative officer for
45:56 this Mark organization called um content
46:00 Evolution and content evolution is is
46:02 it's basically just a a Federation of
46:05 marketing organizations PR firms things
46:07 like that um founded by Kevin Clark who
46:10 used to run IBM's Global brand and he
46:12 basically just said he wanted to retain
46:14 the relationships of the people that he
46:16 liked working with and right so it's
46:17 this it's this very collegial group and
46:21 one of the challenges of it is you know
46:24 if if a business comes to Kevin or to
46:26 anyone in the organization and says hey
46:28 who should I work with within content
46:30 Evolution to do this who should I talk
46:33 to so so this exercise started out is
46:35 just basically we wanted to create a
46:37 directory like how do I know who to talk
46:39 to and and then what we what we thought
46:42 about is you know maybe we'll we'll make
46:44 descriptions of the companies and we can
46:46 just make a like a GPT that makes it
46:48 easy to find them and then we thought
46:50 well it's not really the companies that
46:52 are interesting it's the people that are
46:54 interesting and so our initial thing was
46:56 well what if we scraped LinkedIn and we
46:58 got their LinkedIn profiles and and then
47:00 we could you know search you know use
47:02 chat GPT to search for who I should talk
47:04 to and what struck us was LinkedIn is
47:08 this
47:09 really limited view of sort of the
47:13 historical artifacts of a person right
47:16 like their work history and even that it
47:18 might not be complete depending on how
47:19 much they do right and and and you know
47:22 maybe in that is you know a link to a
47:24 book that they've written but they wrote
47:26 that book 30 years ago and so that might
47:29 not reflect who they are today so so we
47:31 stumbled upon in trying to figure out
47:33 how to how to use LinkedIn we stumbled
47:35 upon this problem of well who are they
47:39 today because who are who they are today
47:41 is really interesting and so what's nice
47:43 about content evolution is you got a
47:45 bunch of smart people in there that are
47:46 really good at things like you know
47:49 writing structured questions and and
47:51 surveys and things like that and so
47:54 Cindy was a part of it and we've
47:55 got this group called collab which is
47:57 our little AI you know uh Skunk Works
47:59 within content Evolution and so we
48:03 design we decided to design a structured
48:07 interview that is designed to capture
48:09 who a person is today and so it's things
48:12 like you know what's your educational
48:13 background what's your work background
48:15 all that sort of stuff right like the
48:16 sort of dog tags but then it's things
48:18 like you know what was a piece of art
48:20 that inspired you you know inspired you
48:22 in your life you know talk about a
48:24 failure you've had so we've got you know
48:26 sections of about how do you solve
48:28 problems and we've got sections about
48:30 you know uh you know how do you what's
48:32 your worldview and things like
48:34 that and so and so we worked with chat
48:37 GPT to come up with the basic framework
48:39 and reorganize it and then we manually
48:41 went in there and tweaked it and what
48:43 we've since learned is that that
48:44 structured interview is really important
48:47 but the specific one that we made for
48:48 Content evolution is essentially
48:51 irrelevant like any sort of structured
48:54 set of interviews like just think 20
48:56 questions and think about it for a use
48:58 case because I could write a set of 20
49:00 questions to really get to who you are
49:03 emotionally an versus who you are as a
49:05 problem solver yeah and and and so we've
49:10 learned a couple of things that that
49:11 that structured interview is really
49:13 important that answering it by writing
49:17 answers doesn't work the gpts are not
49:21 good when you do it by writing answers
49:23 because how you write words is not how
49:26 you say words and very often if you read
49:28 transcripts of what someone says you're
49:30 like this isn't even English like does
49:33 this person ever complete a sentence
49:34 right two very different worlds but who
49:38 but how you talk really does represent
49:40 who you are so what what we did is we
49:42 made an executive decision that anyone
49:45 we're going to make one of these digital
49:46 twins for we have to do a video
49:48 interview where they're going through
49:50 and answering these questions so we have
49:52 someone being the interviewer someone
49:53 being the interviewee we then take the
49:56 transcript of of that and that becomes
49:59 the foundation for a GPT so that's so
50:01 the digital twin right now is just a GPT
50:05 with this interview of who the person
50:07 is then we came upon the problem of
50:11 because again where where we started was
50:14 we need a directory like how do we find
50:15 people right and we said well we've got
50:18 these gpts where someone could have a
50:20 virtual conversation with virtual Kyle
50:22 and that's kind of cool and we we sort
50:24 of put them out like you can have a
50:25 conversation with virtual Kyle right now
50:27 and nobody really cared right because
50:29 it's like no one knows what that means
50:32 what does it mean to have a conversation
50:33 with virtual Kyle so we kind of flipped
50:36 it upside down and said well maybe
50:38 instead of asking other people to figure
50:39 out how we would use our digital twins
50:41 maybe we should figure out how we use
50:43 our digital Twins and so where we've
50:46 kind of gotten to recently is that um
50:49 all of the people within collab have
50:51 basically committed to use their digital
50:53 twins to do things like brainstorming
50:55 like rather than brainstorming with you
50:57 I'm going to brainstorm with the virtual
50:59 version of me but I can also brainstorm
51:02 with the other people within content
51:04 Evolution and I've got access to them
51:05 247 so we took all these individual gpts
51:09 and we put them into a master GPT so
51:11 we've now got this little digital
51:14 community that represents the world
51:16 views of all the people within content
51:19 Evolution and we're using that GPT to
51:23 write articles on behalf of content
51:25 Evolution and even quote the people that
51:27 are most appropriate to talk on that
51:29 subject it it's wild and and and so
51:32 every time we do that um you know Kevin
51:34 will reach out to the individuals that
51:36 are quoted and says you know is this
51:37 what you would say for the most I've had
51:41 one thing where it said the opposite of
51:42 what I said but for the most part it's
51:44 like yeah that's exactly what I would
51:45 say wow and so that idea of so so
51:49 there's a couple of things here one is
51:52 you can make you know a digital twin of
51:54 yourself but you could also make
51:56 multiple digital twins of yourself one
51:58 could be the professional version of you
52:00 one could be the social butterfly one
52:02 could be the jokester that that just
52:04 does jokes one could not even look like
52:06 you and not have your name but you want
52:07 to control it yes and then thinking of
52:11 so if you think about the way llms work
52:15 large language
52:18 models the reason they feel human is
52:21 that we are essentially tapping into the
52:23 collective intelligence of all of the
52:26 people that have contributed anything to
52:28 the internet over the past 70 80 years
52:31 right and and longer than that right
52:32 because of historical documents that got
52:34 put on there so you're literally tapping
52:37 into all of the people that came before
52:39 so the digital twins are actually just a
52:42 really specific representation of a
52:45 person who exists in the world or we've
52:47 also done these for people who have died
52:49 you can also do the same thing for
52:51 people that have died and put all their
52:53 Works in there right um and then we're
52:55 just sort of creating a little
52:57 sandbox where you can now have
52:59 interactions with them and you can group
53:00 them together and it's it's absolutely
53:03 remarkable um it's it's uncanny how
53:05 close they are to how people answer
53:08 questions and solve problems and as we
53:10 move into things like you know real time
53:13 synthesis of faces and voices and things
53:15 like that we're going to be able to
53:16 FaceTime with virtual versions of
53:18 ourselves and and I think this
53:21 skill of thinking about how do I I Kyle
53:26 want to be repres ented in the
53:28 world feels to me like an important
53:30 skill to learn right now because we're
53:32 going to be represented in the world
53:34 whether we want to be or not and if
53:36 you've got some Acuity for how to do
53:39 that with today's janky tools you're
53:42 going to be a much better shape when
53:43 these things get more
53:46 sophisticated there are so many use
53:49 cases like bouncing around in my brain
53:52 it's crazy right but crazy when the one
53:57 of the ideas that I have that I like so
54:01 far the best of the ones that have been
54:02 flying around would be the ability for
54:07 people to create their own board of
54:09 directors to help them decisions yes
54:13 well in fact we've talked about that
54:14 we're we're in content Evolution one of
54:16 the things we're talking about is
54:18 putting together um board of directors
54:21 and executive committee um GPT set so
54:25 think about a board of director s you
54:27 got all these important people on this
54:28 board of directors you get to meet with
54:29 them quarterly for an hour or two you
54:31 have drinks with them and right and you
54:33 can solve the big problem what if you
54:35 had 247 access to some version of them
54:38 yeah right and same with your executive
54:40 teams that 247 you could just say hey
54:43 you know hey team what please all give
54:46 me your opinion like I'm about to make
54:48 this decision and I want you to weigh in
54:51 right and do it from your point of view
54:53 if you've got a well- constructed
54:54 digital twin of those people you're
54:56 going to get all sorts of diverse points
54:58 of view 247
55:01 247 amazing all the all of the like you
55:06 know all the folks who wish they had a
55:11 mentor or wish they had a sponsor right
55:14 who doesn't they don't have connections
55:16 to you know the people where they can
55:18 just sit around with them and and chop
55:20 it up without fear of saying something
55:22 dumb right yeah right like now you get
55:26 to have that and it's whenever you want
55:30 on whatever topic you want and you're
55:33 going to get that feedback in a totally
55:36 safe environment and
55:38 like access this wisdom that you have no
55:41 business having right like it's it's not
55:44 on you that you don't have that wisdom
55:45 yet or you haven't had that life
55:47 experience yet and you get to you get to
55:50 make the most of all of that yeah let
55:53 the commercial applications like I know
55:55 we talked about you know if you're an
55:57 author right now and you're publishing a
55:59 book man have a digital twin that goes
56:02 along with it so people can either
56:04 interact with the characters in the book
56:06 because you've made digital twin for the
56:08 characters which that would be so dope y
56:10 or interact with the author right the
56:13 the yeah I've got one right now for AI
56:15 Futures the the Anthology Book where
56:17 we've got in a in a GPT we've got the
56:20 book itself and then we've got these
56:22 interviews with each of the authors so
56:24 you can go into that GPT right now and
56:26 just talk about the concepts of the book
56:28 but just ask the authors hey Cindy
56:31 what would you think about this it also
56:33 it it radically
56:35 shifts you know right now we talk about
56:37 if you want to be good at AI treat it
56:39 like a conversation and you know it's
56:40 not just like a prompt and get it back
56:42 if you know you're interacting with you
56:44 know the the virtual Irregulars right
56:46 from the Tik Tok Channel you're G to
56:49 interact with that in a very different
56:50 way than if you're just interacting with
56:52 chat GPT which is kind of this amorphous
56:55 you know because it's everything it's
56:56 nothing kind of kind of and so so when
56:59 you kind of limit the scope to these
57:02 digital twins it it really does put you
57:04 in this place of well how do I want to
57:06 interact with them and what questions
57:08 would I ask a virtual board of directors
57:10 oh like yeah I might I might make
57:13 decisions in a very different way if I
57:15 knew I had that as a resource absolutely
57:18 and everybody here on this call you
57:20 should know Gwen she's amazing and she's
57:22 absolutely the kind of friend who will
57:24 say who will remind you that you need to
57:26 summarize for people and tell them and
57:31 tell tell them like give them some some
57:34 some takeaways so yes it's I think that
57:38 it would be something like come up with
57:40 a list of questions yeah well I I would
57:43 say first off figure out who's your who
57:46 like who's the audience like what's or
57:47 what's the purpose of the digital twin
57:50 is it professional is it personal um
57:52 like what's your intent with it so so I
57:55 would say Don't just don't just limit
57:57 yourself to having one digital twin
58:00 maybe do like this might be a good
58:02 exercise maybe one is the professional
58:03 one and one is the fun one and so what
58:06 would be what would those interviews be
58:08 like for you know professional Kyle
58:10 versus fun Kyle so that's the start and
58:13 then yeah work with chat GPT or Claude
58:15 or your llm of choice and say I want to
58:17 come up with a structured interview of
58:19 20 to 25 questions or whatever you're
58:21 comfortable with you know 20 to 25
58:23 questions is probably half an hour like
58:25 a half an hour interview if you're if
58:27 you're like really answering the
58:28 questions um so that's step one get
58:31 those questions and then edit them like
58:33 actually read them and see if there's
58:34 anything you feel is missing and you
58:36 know organize
58:38 them um so that it makes sense for the
58:40 person answering them um the other thing
58:42 you should put in there is basic you
58:44 know biographical information name job
58:46 you know educational background things
58:48 like that so that your twin knows your
58:50 your
58:51 history um and then really important is
58:55 record that interview on video and
58:58 ideally have some third
59:02 party be there as your back channel so
59:05 when you answer a question someone that
59:07 knows you or someone that makes you push
59:09 deeper hey that was kind of a stingy
59:10 answer dig deeper on that like maybe you
59:12 have a a side chat where you've got
59:15 someone just you know really watching
59:17 you and you're talking to them because
59:19 you'll talk in a very different way than
59:21 if you just do it
59:23 yourself yeah then you take that
59:27 transcript of that thing you don't need
59:30 to clean it up this is one of the things
59:32 that was you know we talked before about
59:34 people that expect it to behave in a
59:36 certain way get really frustrated some
59:37 people are like well it doesn't you know
59:39 say this accurately or that accurately
59:41 or I need to go in and I need to edit my
59:43 no you don't because it's just gonna
59:45 hallucinate anyway yeah all it needs to
59:47 capture is your essence so so that
59:49 becomes the core data element of a GPT
59:53 you can also put other things in there
59:55 like things that you written or books or
59:57 links to your company things like that
59:59 you can do that we chose to keep these
1:00:02 things simple and keep it just that
1:00:04 interview because we wanted to see how
1:00:05 they performed when we did this across a
1:00:07 number of people yes yes and then that's
1:00:11 basically it you I mean you need to
1:00:13 write the you need to write your system
1:00:15 prompt in such a way that it that it
1:00:16 kind of responds like you would respond
1:00:18 and you need to give it some rules like
1:00:20 that but that's basically it and then
1:00:23 it's all about how do I use it where do
1:00:24 I use it why would I use it yeah
1:00:27 absolutely and um I'm so happy that you
1:00:30 pointed out the part about the video
1:00:32 because what I I tried to I was doing
1:00:34 this while I was on a road trip I was
1:00:36 asking my well I was like in my head
1:00:38 asking a question and then just like
1:00:40 answering it or telling life stories and
1:00:42 I got so bored listening to myself just
1:00:46 talk in the
1:00:48 car nobody will ever want to like engage
1:00:52 with this because I'm even bored with it
1:00:54 but having somebody there it's youed
1:00:56 talk differently about your life and
1:00:58 whatnot with with with advanced voice I
1:01:01 would argue that you could probably do
1:01:03 this with advanced voice and have it
1:01:04 dynamically write the question set while
1:01:07 you're having the conversation because
1:01:09 it'll record all that just do that in
1:01:10 the car that might be an interesting
1:01:12 experiment I I think that that would be
1:01:15 really fun and this was also before
1:01:17 advanced voice so it was
1:01:19 tedious become so we've become such
1:01:22 spoiled
1:01:23 brats even I have to type something oh I
1:01:27 know okay so Gwen hopefully we will um
1:01:32 hopefully those are tactical enough that
1:01:36 it allows people to charge ahead and I
1:01:39 think it's like so many other things
1:01:40 just play this there's nothing at fake
1:01:44 like like yes I could give you the
1:01:46 prompt yes I could give you the question
1:01:47 sets
1:01:49 but they're not gonna like content
1:01:51 evolution is a very particular kind of
1:01:53 business how we write those questions is
1:01:55 very particular and how we did it for
1:01:57 the book project was completely
1:01:58 different so it's really more learn the
1:02:01 concept and then just go play with it
1:02:04 yes and also you know some someone said
1:02:06 well I'm not comfortable putting myself
1:02:07 out there then okay put out someone
1:02:09 that's called you know Looney Kyle
1:02:12 that's like Looney Bob and and it's you
1:02:15 maybe answer some questions truthfully
1:02:17 but you you make sure that you know it's
1:02:19 not you it's just Looney Bob and Looney
1:02:21 Bob's going to have his own Persona and
1:02:23 things like that right so so don't feel
1:02:25 like the digital twin has to be this big
1:02:28 vulnerable place you go um you can make
1:02:31 it about you but you can also just
1:02:32 experiment with creating these entities
1:02:35 that you're going to interact with make
1:02:37 a character that you can then find out
1:02:40 what the heck they would do in your
1:02:41 story y um as we wrap up I yeah Rick I
1:02:47 typing is so 2024 we will not you know
1:02:51 Paul retzer says by the end of 2026
1:02:53 we're all going to be talking to our
1:02:55 computers I mean every everyone in every
1:02:57 office everywhere so yeah or thinking or
1:02:59 thinking to them yes EXA yeah or
1:03:02 thinking to them unless you're in a
1:03:04 webinar exactly quen so everybody I hope
1:03:09 you found this as fascinating as I did I
1:03:11 could talk to Kyle Shannon for hours and
1:03:13 hours on end it's fun to have a chance
1:03:15 to actually chat back to you because of
1:03:18 you're up on the screen and we're we're
1:03:20 all like we have these um what is it
1:03:23 called the psychosocial or uh the
1:03:26 relationship that people have with
1:03:28 people on screen oh yeah yeah parasocial
1:03:31 a Paras yeah yes but but nobody out
1:03:35 there feel that way because Kyle is a
1:03:37 real everyday downto Earth normal human
1:03:41 being and you should connect with him
1:03:45 follow his content join the AI salon and
1:03:48 if you're looking for people to you know
1:03:51 rap with about AI you can always hit him
1:03:54 up you can always hit me up
1:03:56 we are so here for it we're here for you
1:03:59 in every every bit of your journey along
1:04:01 the way and we're learning like we're
1:04:04 still The Beginner's mindset as well um
1:04:07 Kyle thank you so much for coming on the
1:04:10 show and thank you honestly just for
1:04:12 being you because you're having just be
1:04:15 you being you is H such a huge gift and
1:04:18 so many of us have have learned from you
1:04:22 and have been able to go on and make a
1:04:23 difference for other people so you're
1:04:25 creating quite the quite the family tree
1:04:28 of AI
1:04:29 nerds I appreciate that you're you're
1:04:32 you're one of I am a fan of yours you're
1:04:34 one of my favorites you've been there
1:04:35 pretty much from the beginning of my
1:04:36 journey so so happy to do this anytime
1:04:39 yeah I hope this was valuable and useful
1:04:41 and interesting thanks everybody see you
1:04:43 later